From mirageos-devel-bounces@lists.xenproject.org Fri Apr 05 18:01:27 2024 Return-path: Envelope-to: archives@lists.xenproject.org Delivery-date: Fri, 05 Apr 2024 18:01:27 +0000 Received: from list by lists.xenproject.org with outflank-mailman.701349.1095728 (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1rsnsL-0003mS-84; Fri, 05 Apr 2024 18:01:17 +0000 X-Outflank-Mailman: Message body and most headers restored to incoming version Received: by outflank-mailman (output) from mailman id 701349.1095728; Fri, 05 Apr 2024 18:01:17 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.xenproject.org) by lists.xenproject.org with esmtp (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1rsnsL-0003mL-4S; Fri, 05 Apr 2024 18:01:17 +0000 Received: by outflank-mailman (input) for mailman id 701349; Fri, 05 Apr 2024 18:01:16 +0000 Received: from se1-gles-sth1-in.inumbo.com ([159.253.27.254] helo=se1-gles-sth1.inumbo.com) by lists.xenproject.org with esmtp (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1rsnsJ-0003mF-La for mirageos-devel@lists.xenproject.org; Fri, 05 Apr 2024 18:01:16 +0000 Received: from wfout1-smtp.messagingengine.com (wfout1-smtp.messagingengine.com [64.147.123.144]) by se1-gles-sth1.inumbo.com (Halon) with ESMTPS id 779bab76-f376-11ee-afe6-a90da7624cb6; Fri, 05 Apr 2024 20:01:08 +0200 (CEST) Received: from compute5.internal (compute5.nyi.internal [10.202.2.45]) by mailfout.west.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE84A1C000AC for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2024 14:01:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from imap46 ([10.202.2.96]) by compute5.internal (MEProxy); Fri, 05 Apr 2024 14:01:02 -0400 Received: by mailuser.nyi.internal (Postfix, from userid 501) id 6A3612A2008B; Fri, 5 Apr 2024 14:01:00 -0400 (EDT) X-BeenThere: mirageos-devel@lists.xenproject.org List-Id: Developer list for MirageOS List-Unsubscribe: , List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: mirageos-devel-bounces@lists.xenproject.org Precedence: list Sender: "MirageOS-devel" X-Inumbo-ID: 779bab76-f376-11ee-afe6-a90da7624cb6 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=v0.no; h=cc :content-type:content-type:date:date:from:from:in-reply-to :message-id:mime-version:reply-to:subject:subject:to:to; s= mesmtp; t=1712340061; x=1712426461; bh=0gRfCwe9+MCbhwIhfRKL939EJ nUFHswRXMre3J/9UxQ=; b=kD6tOoe4YY7erEo9wVri4gl8N+69q+cHhnolQbZpP 2YipLQUsUZYF+VBfX79U82A3yqPh8MlZ0eSCKdaNwcPjAIOUpKtdlm5sYg+Yu5Rt YVeX4vmNs5GcjaxJhxdchP8bbEjrzTn6yrKoNVU4+gVuSumwPb+qrHEiEjPDFCHI T0= DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=cc:content-type:content-type:date:date :feedback-id:feedback-id:from:from:in-reply-to:message-id :mime-version:reply-to:subject:subject:to:to:x-me-proxy :x-me-proxy:x-me-sender:x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s=fm2; t= 1712340061; x=1712426461; bh=0gRfCwe9+MCbhwIhfRKL939EJnUFHswRXMr e3J/9UxQ=; b=me9erYOkI3VPCLeFlMQl7YHZxaeOwSwkT6HEoaIKFsdEtyAQ2lP As2iEMO3ygK/fUi+4MHLMvgOx7/GyG9NeV69nmC9w4w4CcSDTh8f4TnQGfMmgwLi /Rhgy564MptCk+3+4AfeAtXG3ZxIvzuq1qeL9r0WeVzLkQsd7yCLIsCXKH20FY1/ iTZRlYDObRStgI+59YJvhUgw6UbgYMHHBqkQuhmu4dT1tZPJMwKbB3mYySDwDEBW SY5RT779T0LLdR0QzY3NfvayebU1bhyEBtzb7L2EBtkf2mgSU3JPxyfMuW+IPnT4 gloKchnLRuLuthxpujfhnXFqTUMbWo4PZlQ== X-ME-Sender: X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedvledrudegtddguddvudcutefuodetggdotefrod ftvfcurfhrohhfihhlvgemucfhrghsthforghilhdpqfgfvfdpuffrtefokffrpgfnqfgh necuuegrihhlohhuthemuceftddtnecunecujfgurhepofgfggfkfffhvffutgesthdtre dtreertdenucfhrhhomhepfdforghgnhhushcuufhkjhgvghhsthgrugdfuceomhgrghhn uhhssehvtddrnhhoqeenucggtffrrghtthgvrhhnpeetveeuuedvueetiedtudeuhedvte ejudfhfeetvdejhedukedvuefgffdvjeejvdenucffohhmrghinhepuggrthgrrdgtohho phdpjhhithdrshhinecuvehluhhsthgvrhfuihiivgeptdenucfrrghrrghmpehmrghilh hfrhhomhepmhgrghhnuhhssehvtddrnhho X-ME-Proxy: Feedback-ID: i11304080:Fastmail X-Mailer: MessagingEngine.com Webmail Interface User-Agent: Cyrus-JMAP/3.11.0-alpha0-333-gbfea15422e-fm-20240327.001-gbfea1542 MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: Date: Fri, 05 Apr 2024 19:59:09 +0200 From: "Magnus Skjegstad" To: mirageos-devel@lists.xenproject.org Subject: MirageOS meeting 2024-04-08 Content-Type: text/plain Hi everyone, The next MirageOS community call will be Monday April 8th at 9:00-10:00 CEST. As usual everyone is welcome to attend this bi-weekly meeting. The current agenda is here: https://pad.data.coop/wGS4r8RyTKqQ73mcw7FrwA Feel free to add any additional items you'd like to discuss. The Jitsi link for the meeting is https://meet.jit.si/mirageos-call See you there, Magnus From mirageos-devel-bounces@lists.xenproject.org Mon Apr 08 08:16:59 2024 Return-path: Envelope-to: archives@lists.xenproject.org Delivery-date: Mon, 08 Apr 2024 08:16:59 +0000 Received: from list by lists.xenproject.org with outflank-mailman.701819.1096327 (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1rtkBM-00013I-Q4; Mon, 08 Apr 2024 08:16:48 +0000 X-Outflank-Mailman: Message body and most headers restored to incoming version Received: by outflank-mailman (output) from mailman id 701819.1096327; Mon, 08 Apr 2024 08:16:48 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.xenproject.org) by lists.xenproject.org with esmtp (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1rtkBM-00013A-Lz; Mon, 08 Apr 2024 08:16:48 +0000 Received: by outflank-mailman (input) for mailman id 701819; Mon, 08 Apr 2024 08:16:48 +0000 Received: from se1-gles-flk1-in.inumbo.com ([94.247.172.50] helo=se1-gles-flk1.inumbo.com) by lists.xenproject.org with esmtp (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1rtkBL-000134-Oy for mirageos-devel@lists.xenproject.org; Mon, 08 Apr 2024 08:16:48 +0000 Received: from mail.mehnert.org (mail.mehnert.org [213.73.89.200]) by se1-gles-flk1.inumbo.com (Halon) with ESMTPS id 55dd83fe-f580-11ee-a1ef-f123f15fe8a2; Mon, 08 Apr 2024 10:16:44 +0200 (CEST) Received: from [192.168.42.80] (i5C74C1D8.versanet.de [92.116.193.216]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "hannes@mehnert.org", Issuer "mehnert root CA" (not verified)) by mail.mehnert.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 22311B7DB for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2024 10:16:43 +0200 (CEST) X-BeenThere: mirageos-devel@lists.xenproject.org List-Id: Developer list for MirageOS List-Unsubscribe: , List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: mirageos-devel-bounces@lists.xenproject.org Precedence: list Sender: "MirageOS-devel" X-Inumbo-ID: 55dd83fe-f580-11ee-a1ef-f123f15fe8a2 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=mehnert.org; s=mail; t=1712564203; bh=TAq+8g/weo7imhtHvOczKwnBp47naRMk4tLD9Ol65xA=; h=Date:Subject:To:References:From:In-Reply-To; b=kKRrYDtQEualHVf72yCRiMgH6/sdBPSai1hEKYUtiilLrc//nqOxXNgt7BfJve/bH 19PKUAG/YTuD20nJWPuOSpl0XLhjwyLZ/WBB2+wmOLCmCTNL3jx/pKh9rtW6yf95+b 4l1+Zv5el5Q5x783E4NTtfR6fk+X33gEi5BJJx/Uj6g7l7ChrvdyIMnCrJTwmncfiv qUY0fPzBW4vPpR42W7zNVxiaqJaxOOintcpBL6oU1lVFA/YeDz8pp1537f2Iw0vDLW 1bdzIjmJs5D2lWnGyXl6CMizhM2aml9FsC4cIs2UDF1wx8tbiQtGRCQbt9hogu1t0b 4R6fesGqrfdYg== Message-ID: Date: Mon, 8 Apr 2024 08:16:42 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: MirageOS meeting 2024-03-25 To: mirageos-devel References: <3bee503c-445a-4b8b-88b1-6421c17d489f@app.fastmail.com> Content-Language: en-US From: Hannes Mehnert Autocrypt: addr=hannes@mehnert.org; keydata= xsFLBEIw1AoBEADAtXwEV8F1DBpE9lnBTbHDNeZwDVp84MhxxIT5GUexGgbOWGSEWHhC3rYe FfGRUxF4M9P4fwxpxCS5YCvxoijWHeEf8nG5IkztVv5cw63E443XWHcCMc80YAwglZ2cSP4U GTNeKb9rqVPckk/PL348BYRawhzvZK+Bc+bUvbtPCfUXT1BWIxAR1dzsfpAQVNZ4bA06xOoP QJYVNgl/lWOmQgnSgb0dE2zsgddKTOj05ru7Q7LobB7WAUTRJVkZcXnrvI1SOt/WbPTyqF8l RBh94xCqFhv4SlqZVOTXxo9gw3LpDv/cYXRl/m7+/7Wljl3ziQ9cawA6O1mbw8nm7Sfa+TZl qo+5lXEenXG+MCbH0XnnL2I4BO6HSGDtKX6htTG2xs6w4r9mVxTGJuJcGrC0dxuz5j4jylt/ KOVn9IaRKzhj8ga7kWffMp+JYdrn43732weoFFJxm78mD2ij4UbJtNkQIIcTv8IBJajHy2P3 h1NuBIwwb7RmBav4oo0CKWoasIHFwjMSBpCzJ8QOHeO/F3TY3DZp7FTwViUgSXVJoewO9yFG ctX7MC27/F1IonU9/SJW0j+F3Vz32SfxUBrDnLYpO7/vwA8w+xmWLnl0iJN/8injz5+CigsP e7O66t4MtC9BVCuLu7a/ikH5nW0q6RyTW8of9eZIsuEyqF1ZPwAGKc0jSGFubmVzIE1laG5l cnQgPGhhbm5lc0BtZWhuZXJ0Lm9yZz7CwXQEEwECAB4FAkIw1A0CGwMGCwkIBwMCAxUCAwMW AgECHgECF4AACgkQvIlliN98KO5HYg//UD6gk4sFcNop/EQivcnpfPnHrrUddsBl9bovQSXb zIh5HY/8xhO5i87n5Aox9jYLcZwa6HJ3ElHMOa+n9AY4/+H8bd+BiHWTgEhEzcZqcYwyP2S2 0X/e/m/+1XYs5tldKNZb7ruYRv6rNyUAF1H8EtYNaJpmGtXYurkMhWhEgeP9YB7svmkUN+JO og91tNhN1Wd10/JfKIytNcpXmW6zij0f3MJw/kdwIsmfSUMPaiEli+eB7nU0uLZWf4C3MWTT NmwNznEya5K9McH1Wc/lO9+oB+zRXFBUM/v9YaiyPZo0JcwSRdVYKvKteyqnL/lnx7vtkOnA EC/bcmMvlWLI+Q4Vw2cr2FKcIpJVwswZ5snFqgDr4O5JB88aEAzPFzyWWeBlVqXc0DbDu8jD YmG3yp/xn5UJQSRy6eUcXICNjJyIwekUCznRmhtGwkGFCFEZH/s2fQ7nETxZcuiE4meRnVQE 9lOafI5D+dlsG3SlyN1x0YvrPismep7PwA6FX3cDyz2iUUj4xICLvRLU6kq892KuFmv75pop VAZjJMQqc8BG3oN2YkDcO4NEuOT9/r9muk/WH5Mqcs2BJEG6+yiQ13uMS5TxXiPFp3vKRlq0 MFnm7YRZr5aK6B/WGLOHnRRb2OdAzUgsj4Qiyqvh8Ab+x9wjLwGePxlA1akrF2hQItfOwUsE QjDUdAEQAOHG4vdGxU3eH5hYDLYRsQP6ofoU36pV8iFEtZRJ833L5p9GP2xFUGVDH8yTdkdf QR1prsCJXA7sE/gYBf3k9lGicJQmYNo3uW9Ngz787BhiQJyW/JXcutyTt9b/AZmfJaDo1p0C 8IEtoG7wt4+giFwAJ1brTJtyxlKOGcjWiKh1/dTh13muXSOPcCmhNs4Zm0YNjrhW9nIn1iik lpMRJCCxY1RNcU2VZXfTqq63UTaIrZ1lgYXWilnTdpXt5UEDYBw8Ee6tpPfQflC02e8hbDeD JEP9MTM9pmmPOwZQXP36hTryakKt1Kpw3hgC+Yx9q4wwaZ4XIiWUgopT5mlI+LhnzCgO05YN NcPrbsr6Js34gC3odNicD+C1jSdOXCqAPZZNiVx0PBjRv+LbBZhUkjQJxidvXmrp55pLm+Ua IVl3E/HpFY8kTaJBHP7jvLp+W4J9tP64Ijk5Y9F0z93JwMspG671xuomFsRxUtyO6vldd7qH 1yVzDX7Dd0fAzMDOPQJW6zLiixCmA0McaZdeBXapMJDDoZAPY4pCbRyJJXe0tfv9ufzJrM8Z JHylONdBiIKWw0JldXkUvIGafl1JDOHjP1XoDWrSDO8yFhBR3uWxJy9u1s7aKvonQb5IcYU1 nPu1Olg3doPugXyC0V05MIa68iKw+Kv8KtDDWyibndoTAAYpwsFfBBgBAgAJBQJCMNR1AhsM AAoJELyJZYjffCjuelUP/jlCsxLzu3fZpuORY2LsOQMd4nFHSZLUjauLxDUn8jE//32IIJ0v QV9ab4k7JCLOuYJTTd9aYD6rkITZIVhAcsR/FQZNgVOvGTj6tAmNyn385vMz0p4bLOOy5T0C KMLKzzS4Rt4XgtzvH2xDXSHfPsqS/t/5WFkO+aLgcPALldWGQPgRu5DNoCLr989gCGu5vmd4 XwMRBt/LmJGI0v0EypL3eRmlGaUw5k6N1hStu4EETzdikAzXP5KTuloEXq/caYeUs/SIb5zi XVC1ISW0CIwj5ATbMh8DMG4splXCsajtnJjsKJATBZIWV4XoNqtgV+pQn1ShmW36nUfVGqzX AQ+9i/M+CCkxBrb85Bk8I1CA1nBHNk5SQqER40VRp6vcmuxvIBGi6t8dDWsDQ2q3kd4RjjDZ kYjSie7176bb9t5MfUGjA9WckHuyi+vjy3+sC/nRzByhXf+8iZsO2no3xWZkGUWI8F2hhpzW VsXqvC27LZvJk53fJbpuSueN8a7JKfbKPDqoDSsRaEtcM7ig475tqA/ZCzv6mdqhEV5buoLu cpW7UgYzjNQQXeYZygGWc7FTV3dqLmF1MY2+RlydQbUDjcj1CJ+UmKyxgoLyf7ru0sznr7Tp K4WDnVeJdWX1mqoSupF/u5LON1vpzh3OIl5NNAuV68Hb5On/ALC+DwFX In-Reply-To: <3bee503c-445a-4b8b-88b1-6421c17d489f@app.fastmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, the meeting notes from two weeks ago: Participants: Magnus, Pierre, Thomas, Vincent, Reynir, Samuel, Romain, Hannes, Shakthi - What do we want Mirage5 to look like? And when do we want to make a release? (Thomas) - runtime args - many changes in mirage tool, so should probably be in next release - Hannes: would be nice to release this early, could be part of ocaml5 - but could also release as 4.x - Ocaml 5 support - need ocaml5 support, at least single core support in solo5 - could release multicore support later - Hannes: ocaml5 doesn't need changes in all of mirage? thomas: we could separate it, but could also make mirageos5 the ocaml5 release. Multicore support will probably require more tooling changes (e.g. if we add support for new runtime), could start with single core support in solo5 - dune pkg? - support the new dune pkg system, alpha expected in may - Hannes: has already been delayed, so suggest not waiting for this. Thomas: should be ready for may this time - Romain: dune pkg aims to resolve some of the issues we have with opam monorepo, where can we discuss the issues with dune team? Thomas: team building and testing packages now, blocker at the moment is that packages are required to be relocatable. - https://github.com/ocaml/dune/issues?q=is%3Aopen+is%3Aissue+milestone%3A%22Package+Management+MVP%22 - Romain: to clarify the story about cross-compilation, only few packages requires it actually and mainly packages with C stubs (Zarith, digestif, mirage-crypto). So, we don't systematically need to "dunify" all packages (like dbuenzli packages). So it's good that `dune pkg` considers packages as a black box package which does not need dune to build - hannes: Good package to test x-compilation is Zarith/GMP - Romain: Zarith/GMP will still need an overlay however considering the status of the dunification of this package (https://github.com/ocaml/Zarith/pull/143) - No more Lwt? - larger discussion, may not be able to resolve this now, but start discussion - Hannes: this could be a separate discussion and will require some evaluation as well. Not sure we're ready to move away from this by next release. Several alternative schedulers - Thomas: Agree it's early, we need to experiment. Currently we see that Lwt binds are very slow (see irmin benchmarks, where they allocate a lot) so we would like to experiment with alternate solutions for Mirage - Thomas: ocaml5 support single core + runtime args could be an ocaml5 release, then later in the year we could add support for dune pkg and multicore support - Thomas: will write a suggestion for release candidate and we can discuss in two weeks - PRs: - [mirage/mirage#1495](https://github.com/mirage/mirage/pull/1495): refactor Dune files - If you have tooling issues (e.g. merlin not working properly) please let Thomas know and this could be fixed in this PR - Two conflicting design issues; if you only build a single unikernel in a repo then the workflow is ok, but doesn't match mirage skeleton - where we build 10 unikernels in one go after configuring each of them. Do we want the ability to have multiple unikernels in a single repo? Hannes: Never used this, usually build from each directory - Building MirageOS Library packages on Alpine 3.19 [Summary](https://hackmd.io/_0QAwb0rS72wDx52hkegPA). Reference: https://ocaml.ci.dev/github/mirage CI builds - Shakthi: trying to build for alpine in CI, have some patches. Are some other distro failures as well. I could start with a subset and fix common failures. - Thomas: seems to be working in regular CI, should investigate what the difference is. Nice to have Alpine support, so upstreaming would be good - MirageOS retreat in Marrakech (Hannes) - 18 people signed up! - Cstruct.t vs bytes/string - Hannes: working on removing cstruct in various repositories. E.g. mirage-crypto. Result is very nice, we see performance improvements. Plan is to remove cstruct in the whole network stack. Not planned in the tcp part of mirage-tcpip (as it's very big), but in the other packages in the stack. Also tools that use ocaml heap produce more interesting results, like statmemprof. - Thomas: what type of benchmarks? Hannes: micro benchmarks, performance measurements, throughput for symmetric ciphers. No improvement for large blocks, but for smaller there is (1024 and less) - mirage-flow 4.x and shutdown - Hannes: added shutdown function so you can close the connection, based on initial work from Dave. Have some PRs open, would be nice to have reviews. Thomas: Dave will take a look at mirage-tcpip - Romain: currently testing tls with shutdown. Works better with http - Next meeting will be April 8th, same time From mirageos-devel-bounces@lists.xenproject.org Mon Apr 08 08:18:31 2024 Return-path: Envelope-to: archives@lists.xenproject.org Delivery-date: Mon, 08 Apr 2024 08:18:31 +0000 Received: from list by lists.xenproject.org with outflank-mailman.701824.1096332 (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1rtkCz-0001Fa-VR; Mon, 08 Apr 2024 08:18:29 +0000 X-Outflank-Mailman: Message body and most headers restored to incoming version Received: by outflank-mailman (output) from mailman id 701824.1096332; Mon, 08 Apr 2024 08:18:29 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.xenproject.org) by lists.xenproject.org with esmtp (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1rtkCz-0001FT-S5; Mon, 08 Apr 2024 08:18:29 +0000 Received: by outflank-mailman (input) for mailman id 701824; Mon, 08 Apr 2024 08:18:28 +0000 Received: from se1-gles-flk1-in.inumbo.com ([94.247.172.50] helo=se1-gles-flk1.inumbo.com) by lists.xenproject.org with esmtp (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1rtkCy-0001F7-PD for mirageos-devel@lists.xenproject.org; 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charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hello, our next meeting is on April 29th 09:00 CEST (https://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?msg=MirageOS+call&iso=20240429T09&ah=1) on https://meet.jit.si/mirageos-call Agenda is tracked on https://pad.data.coop/wGS4r8RyTKqQ73mcw7FrwA?both# The meetings notes from today: Participants: Magnus, Pierre, Kaushik, Vincent, Shakthi, Reynir, Hannes, Thomas, Samuel - Why are you here? - Kaushik: 2nd meeting, want to understand what he didn't know that he didn't know; use MirageOS in real-world problem solving - Vincent: working at Tarides on SpaceOS, still learning MirageOS, learn and understand what is going on; prepare the Marrakech retreat - Pierre: associate professor in network security, know and understand what people are working on in the MirageOS ecosystem, uses QubesOS (and the mirage-qubes-firewall) and MirageOS, is motivated to get rid of cstruct (based on bigarrays, there are issues (with q-m-f & bigarray due to malloc)), interested in the OCaml 5 release of MirageOS for better performance - Magnus: working on MirageOS since ~10 years, interested in the technology, worked on MirageOS in Docker, Tarides, now back to research -- working e.g. on IncludeOS/MirageOS performance with Alfred - Shakthi: works at Tarides on the ocaml.org team, fixing CI issues, looking at good first issues for newcomers - Samuel: engineer at Tarides, worked in the last months on OCaml 5 support for MirageOS (now solo5 works on OCaml 5.2 beta), works on Unikraft support for MirageOS, has interest in low-level stuff - Reynir: work in robur.coop with hannes and dinosaure, we develop MirageOS applications and maintain quite some libraries, interest to develop and deploy applications - Thomas: working on MirageOS for a while, happy to see the call starting again, still there are several parties interested in MirageOS, nice area of system research, interest: how to apply that to deployment - how to improve the IT landscape, MirageOS brings something new to IT (type-safe, memory-safe, formal verification): low-level systems with high-level languages, short term interest: CLI tool is more usable / friendly -- the OCaml ecosystem has evolved a lot since MirageOS started -- take ideas from MirageOS and upstream them to OCaml - Hannes: Interest in getting MirageOS used & deployed -- has had this goal for roughly a decade since he started on Mirage. Have done a PhD about formal verification of java programs. Would like to have more formally verified systems, so joined Mirage OS project where there is less mutable state. Worked on network protocols. Recent months worked on performance as we should have good performance when we run without kernel & user space. Not afraid of big API changes - they are a challenge. Big performance bottleneck is bigarray allocations, so recent PRs have been about replacing cstruct with string or bytes with promising benchmark results. How do we safely and pragmatically remove bounds checks? Worked on dependently typed systems such as Coq (now Rocq) and Idris where this is somewhat easier to express safely. Wants people to run their own services instead of using Google etc. Interested in getting reproducible builds for deployment reasons. Also interested in binary sizes. Getting more deployments requires getting more people involved => organizing retreats and hanging out on the weekly call to get more people interested/involved (since it is not feasible to do it alone). - Proposal for next MirageOS release 4.5.0 (Thomas) - Contents: what we have now in `main` (main update: runtime arguments) - When: before or after the retreat? - Proposal: Dune UX not quite ready for 5.0, better to release current version. Would be nice to release this before the retreat, so people there have an opportunity to test. So suggest tagging the release now and updating the documentation. Then continue discussion about other features. - Will make release before the retreat - Next: better Dune integration with Mirage - Design doc: https://gist.github.com/samoht/98127448fcf6a2483fa36099649fba5a -- feedback welcome! - PR: https://github.com/mirage/mirage/pull/1495 - Blockers: bugs in Dune - need experiments with the UX/UI (promotion?) - Next: OCaml5 + Mirage - PR almost ready: https://github.com/shym/ocaml-solo5/tree/ocaml-5.2 with its [Description](https://paste.sr.ht/~rustyne/0f76561709ca6c28852fae312e835e1059918f6e). - Hannes: this is very exciting. Just to be clear, the new ocaml-solo5 will only support OCaml 5.2, if we need releases for 4.x compatibility, we'll just branch off the latest release and put in changes - Thomas: it would also be nice if cross-compilation worked again on MacOS, can test - Next: `dune pkg` + Miragemail-betreuung bis nächsten montag übernehmen - The performance perspective: "no-cstruct" and bounds checking (Hannes) - opam overlay https://github.com/robur-coop/no-cstruct - Hannes: would be nice to have a mirage release that would support this as it needs changes to the mirage tool - Started thread to discuss using type system for bounds checking, but looks like this would require ppx right now, which I'd like to avoid: https://discuss.ocaml.org/t/bounds-checks-for-string-and-bytes-when-retrieving-or-setting-subparts-thereof/14422/6 - Interested in testing whether programs runs faster if bounds checks are removed from the compiler, how much faster is it? - `-unsafe` doesn't remove bounds checks from `String.get_*` - but a modified Stdlib (or compiler) emitting no bounds checks could do the trick - then measure on some real applications and take a look at the difference - Random/Clock/Time functors (Hannes) https://github.com/mirage/mirage/issues/1513 - As Hannes understands, a functor is useful if we use a single implementation multiple times (e.g. Set/Map -- a set of string, a set of int) - All Mirage unikernels are functorised over these. Have not seen different implementations of these, could we simplify the unikernels to not use functors for these? - we could replace that by the "linking trick" (dune variants) - testing sometimes (such as mirage-tcpip) uses a clock that runs faster than - would be great to cope with that - Next meeting in three weeks (Apr 29th 09:00 CEST), skip one week due to retreat -- https://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?msg=MirageOS+call&iso=20240429T09&ah=1 On 05/04/2024 17:59, Magnus Skjegstad wrote: > Hi everyone, > > The next MirageOS community call will be Monday April 8th at 9:00-10:00 CEST. > > As usual everyone is welcome to attend this bi-weekly meeting. The current agenda is here: https://pad.data.coop/wGS4r8RyTKqQ73mcw7FrwA > > Feel free to add any additional items you'd like to discuss. > > The Jitsi link for the meeting is https://meet.jit.si/mirageos-call > > See you there, > > Magnus > From mirageos-devel-bounces@lists.xenproject.org Mon Apr 29 07:12:22 2024 Return-path: Envelope-to: archives@lists.xenproject.org Delivery-date: Mon, 29 Apr 2024 07:12:22 +0000 Received: from list by lists.xenproject.org with outflank-mailman.713872.1114754 (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1s1LBL-0004Db-S6; Mon, 29 Apr 2024 07:12:11 +0000 X-Outflank-Mailman: Message body and most headers restored to incoming version Received: by outflank-mailman (output) from mailman id 713872.1114754; Mon, 29 Apr 2024 07:12:11 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.xenproject.org) by lists.xenproject.org with esmtp (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1s1LBL-0004DU-P8; Mon, 29 Apr 2024 07:12:11 +0000 Received: by outflank-mailman (input) for mailman id 713872; Mon, 29 Apr 2024 07:12:10 +0000 Received: from se1-gles-flk1-in.inumbo.com ([94.247.172.50] helo=se1-gles-flk1.inumbo.com) by lists.xenproject.org with esmtp (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1s1LBJ-0004DO-VX for mirageos-devel@lists.xenproject.org; Mon, 29 Apr 2024 07:12:10 +0000 Received: from fout8-smtp.messagingengine.com (fout8-smtp.messagingengine.com [103.168.172.151]) by se1-gles-flk1.inumbo.com (Halon) with ESMTPS id c8fc342a-05f7-11ef-b4bb-af5377834399; Mon, 29 Apr 2024 09:12:07 +0200 (CEST) Received: from compute5.internal (compute5.nyi.internal [10.202.2.45]) by mailfout.nyi.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6171A1380FA7 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2024 03:12:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from imap46 ([10.202.2.96]) by compute5.internal (MEProxy); Mon, 29 Apr 2024 03:12:05 -0400 Received: by mailuser.nyi.internal (Postfix, from userid 501) id EE09A2A20077; Mon, 29 Apr 2024 03:12:04 -0400 (EDT) X-BeenThere: mirageos-devel@lists.xenproject.org List-Id: Developer list for MirageOS List-Unsubscribe: , List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: mirageos-devel-bounces@lists.xenproject.org Precedence: list Sender: "MirageOS-devel" X-Inumbo-ID: c8fc342a-05f7-11ef-b4bb-af5377834399 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=v0.no; h=cc :content-type:content-type:date:date:from:from:in-reply-to :message-id:mime-version:reply-to:subject:subject:to:to; s= mesmtp; t=1714374725; x=1714461125; bh=Ie+WqmEWCV0p15or8FWJzob1V b/Rh7fIM6dG+6Es9JY=; b=ztXVFNu8lTEMFtRy1wSIZo06t+pnmFODvSmyhWRL9 O7baKbMiD886+PttLSt8SZX0WPMAhJqrGTROpTM23X5WuWY7Xavc78bkFIYi+VAc LEiXjIugl4eglTdp2RK3RYXjNa7csKYN3ZS9ygK/Z83OEmqCvYy1g9rQdd+Ygil5 tY= DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=cc:content-type:content-type:date:date :feedback-id:feedback-id:from:from:in-reply-to:message-id :mime-version:reply-to:subject:subject:to:to:x-me-proxy :x-me-proxy:x-me-sender:x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s=fm3; t= 1714374725; x=1714461125; bh=Ie+WqmEWCV0p15or8FWJzob1Vb/Rh7fIM6d G+6Es9JY=; b=aAaP2fw3RMp7IsHGvToLz7WmQlfxUF9YlIccNykzYdaqozLqIMM 4qkqIYqwUMV6xLUIbKVfNAmvxpNiHzZt6qh7Qc8UKrHcfMUVLFqGxSEeEjFquJP4 e2E6ZvYGu0m/sqZbryUKZg1UNzlCJLywEThOMeox18YEFhI2iavkfZh7HMzxc/41 MKXCDmH0A5u0Zqjwl3QRVLLOnniVrD8sqATWHl5mLnICbEpfLaRQ1/6LMlm2G5tF UbqW5IbR7L47xlq4/hccCRv02vGcNlEvrXmpvqY8cirkCWRGI9mjITMxtIEP2tE2 5qtm/MqZYovadmOHnKFXd4qgfIF2MXujADw== X-ME-Sender: X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedvledrvddutddgudduucetufdoteggodetrfdotf fvucfrrhhofhhilhgvmecuhfgrshhtofgrihhlpdfqfgfvpdfurfetoffkrfgpnffqhgen uceurghilhhouhhtmecufedttdenucenucfjughrpefofgggkfffhffvufgtsehttdertd erredtnecuhfhrohhmpedfofgrghhnuhhsucfukhhjvghgshhtrggufdcuoehmrghgnhhu shesvhdtrdhnoheqnecuggftrfgrthhtvghrnhepteevueeuvdeuteeitdduueehvdetje duhfeftedvjeehudekvdeugfffvdejjedvnecuffhomhgrihhnpegurghtrgdrtghoohhp pdhjihhtrdhsihenucevlhhushhtvghrufhiiigvpedtnecurfgrrhgrmhepmhgrihhlfh hrohhmpehmrghgnhhushesvhdtrdhnoh X-ME-Proxy: Feedback-ID: i11304080:Fastmail X-Mailer: MessagingEngine.com Webmail Interface User-Agent: Cyrus-JMAP/3.11.0-alpha0-386-g4cb8e397f9-fm-20240415.001-g4cb8e397 MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <6d59dce9-95e2-4715-82be-34b0c47added@app.fastmail.com> Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2024 09:11:40 +0200 From: "Magnus Skjegstad" To: mirageos-devel@lists.xenproject.org Subject: Next MirageOS meeting 2024-05-06 Content-Type: text/plain Hi everyone, The next MirageOS community call will be Monday May 6th at 9:00-10:00 CEST. As usual everyone is welcome to attend this bi-weekly meeting. The current agenda is here: https://pad.data.coop/wGS4r8RyTKqQ73mcw7FrwA Feel free to add any additional items you'd like to discuss. The Jitsi link for the meeting is https://meet.jit.si/mirageos-call See you there, Magnus From mirageos-devel-bounces@lists.xenproject.org Mon Apr 29 14:43:22 2024 Return-path: Envelope-to: archives@lists.xenproject.org Delivery-date: Mon, 29 Apr 2024 14:43:22 +0000 Received: from list by lists.xenproject.org with outflank-mailman.714115.1115126 (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1s1SDp-0002Tj-73; Mon, 29 Apr 2024 14:43:13 +0000 X-Outflank-Mailman: Message body and most headers restored to incoming version Received: by outflank-mailman (output) from mailman id 714115.1115126; Mon, 29 Apr 2024 14:43:13 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.xenproject.org) by lists.xenproject.org with esmtp (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1s1SDp-0002Tc-4B; Mon, 29 Apr 2024 14:43:13 +0000 Received: by outflank-mailman (input) for mailman id 714115; Mon, 29 Apr 2024 14:43:12 +0000 Received: from se1-gles-sth1-in.inumbo.com ([159.253.27.254] helo=se1-gles-sth1.inumbo.com) by lists.xenproject.org with esmtp (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1s1SDn-0002TW-CG for mirageos-devel@lists.xenproject.org; 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charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dear everyone, this is a headsup to let you know the package "mirage-profile" - which served for a good time to get traces in a xen shared ring for debugging unikernels, has been removed. The background is that when we introduced solo5-xen-pvh support (since solo5 0.6.6, released 2020-07-21) - used by mirage 3.9.0 (2020-10-24), we no longer supported this tracing methodology. As you can observe in https://ocaml.org/p/mirage-profile/latest, the mirage-profile package itself has been removed as dependency from all of our packages, and we just marked the mirage-profile repository as archived. In the future, we expect to adapt OCaml 5 runtime tracing events for MirageOS unikernels - after we merge and release the OCaml 5 support for MirageOS :) In a similar direction, the ppx_cstruct has been removed from a lot of core package. The reasoning is that ppx_cstruct has a huge dependency cone and generates a lot of code (in size and number of functions) - so we were able to enable warning 32 at more places :) This is as well a preparation for upcoming experimental changes (to use strings/bytes instead of bigarrays for allocations). Please stay tuned, and if you encounter any issues and miss functionality, please open issues at the relevant repositories (if unclear where, just submit it at https://github.com/mirage/mirage). All the best from the negative line count department (and stay tuned for upcoming code line removals), Hannes