Re: [Xen-users] Under the table experiment

[Ted Hilts <thilts@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Soffi

This is a very unfortunate incident but you have left me NO choice but to
respond. You should never do this to people.

It's amazing how you would think an experiment was marketing or some kind
of exploitation. But it seems you do. Perhaps you did not understand what
the experiment was about.  I did not want to trouble the list with an experiment
as it seems you have now done. I have been on many lists where many people
did things aside of the list. But that's okay, those interested on this list
will respond, those not interested won't. They will make up their own mind
now you have included them with your CC.  But there is no need to start flaming
away.  "1000 sorrys" for upsetting you so badly. If I had known your reaction
I would not have asked. I don't want to go through life upsetting anyone
unnecessarily especially people that flame over nothing.  Apparently I asked
the wrong person to assist and for that I apologize.  

FYI my expectations for this experiment (which I cannot do here on my LAN
right now as I had explained and everyone will read for them selves) was
to determine ahead of time how newbees and others using the distribution
would react when Dom 0 booted up to different hardware and it's configuration
files had to be changed. This concern should have been obvious by the use
of the word "experiment". This is a common situation on the [SLE] list when
hardware changes occur (CPU board, chip sets, NIC etc.,) and people want
to know what to do.  I need to know what kind of user concerns surface in
order to provide a proper web page for each Dom 0 to be handled by the server.
It was that straightforward and simple.  I have learned to expect the unexpected.
 But I admit your flaming did get me unexpectedly.  You should maybe do some
introspection and examine your attitudes and motivations behind your behavior.

It might be interesting for you to know that I have Dom 0 and DomU installations
working on my LAN and I am not interested in getting someone to do my work
or thinking for me.  I say what I mean so there is no reason to read between
the lines and come to the wrong conclusions.  I do believe in team work and
have spent many many years in Engineering and IT. A lot of people think because
they are working with others they are a team.  But teamwork is far far more
than a group of people.  Teamwork involves people with different skill sets
not people with the same skill set.  It is the merger of skill sets and the
cooperative and supportive environment that defines a real team. But I am
also not ashamed to ask questions. And there are lots of others on hundreds
of  lists like this one that ask questions other people don't ask. That is
one of the beauties of a list. In a way a list should function as a team.
Yes, I consider myself a newbee when it comes to Xen.  So what? I have no
interest is presenting myself to others as something I am not.  I have enough
credentials and achievements in life so I don't have to generate more to
impress people. You can run CVS and other source code tools from my LAN.
 I have customized kernels and all sorts of things. As I said, I have running
Xen-systems on my LAN.  So I don't like being presented before the list as
an incompetent techie with brains less than a cow that no one should listen
to or help. I don't think anyone wants to be thought of that way.  And as
life would have it people that burn down someone else's house usually get
their own house burned down. What goes around comes around. But then I can't
stop you from such conduct -- can I?  And I don't want to be party to or
engage in such conduct.  I could have ignored your response, you could have
kept it between you and me, but instead you have created an unfortunate incident
involving the entire list that most people will find offensive and newbees
will be scared off the list for fear of being flamed.  Shame on you Soffi.

Thanks anyway, sticks and stones will break my bones but names can never
hurt me -- I learned that in grade 2.  I will just go this whole thing alone
and you are always welcome to download a Dom 0 or a DomU distribution or
run a test directly from the LAN.  But remember you will have to register
and operate with an ID so I will know that I have helped you -- a person
that would rather insult me than be a team player with me.  In the future
and to protect the list from more of this garbage I would appreciate no more
correspondence on this subject (if there is I won't respond and will advise
the list manager) and I will stay away from your email and would respect
that you do the same with mine.  

I am not leaving the list because you flamed me. This is a very unfortunate
incident Soffi and you created it. It is the first such incident on this
list and I apologize to everyone that it has happened.  I will try to be
more careful when asking for any kind of help and I will stay off the list
for a while.

Thanks -- Ted



Kristinn Soffanias Runarsson wrote:
> Dude, take it to the list, I take no pleasure in discussing marketing
> with you privately.
>
> What are your actual contributions to the Xen community?  save your
> big words until you get the big iron.  No one is going to do this
> *FOR* you privately.  Gain some knowledge, gain some patience and gain
> some respect in the process.  I hate to sound rude but... google for
> RTFM and find out on your own.
>
> huge pile of regards,
> -soffi-
>
>
> On Apr 5, 2005 6:12 PM, Ted Hilts <thilts@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> > Soffi
> >
> > I would like to try an experiment.  There seems to be a fair number of
> > people having problems of one sort or another putting together a
> > properly working  Dom 0.  I am guessing but you probably have enough
> > spare storage to host 1 or 2 Dom 0 distributions.  For example, Antoine
> > (web master of Xen French --
> >
> > XENfr.org
> >
> > ) quickly put together a Debian Sarge base on Xen.
> >
> > I would like Antoine, if he would be kind enough to do so, and that is
> > to wrap up both the source (Debian + Xen that he used) along with the
> > binary he created into a bz2 tarball so that it would unwrap where ever
> > one wanted to put their Dom0.  Maybe he could also include in this
> > tarball his GRUB boot file -- if helpful for install on someone else's
> > system.  If Antoine wishes to cooperate, put his file in a directory on
> > your FTP server which we will call "antoine_dom0_debian" and the tarball
> > we will call "antoine_dom0_debian.tar.bz2".  Note the compression. When
> > you get it perhaps you and someone else could try the
> > "antoine_dom0_debian distribution.  If it proves successful as a dom0
> > distribution then you make it available from your location (and mirror)
> > until I get my facilities up an running.  You will probably encounter a
> > lot of heavy traffic on your server as I have a feeling this will be
> > very popular for many reasons. I would like to keep this "under the
> > table" until we prove by doing, that it will be an easy task for anyone
> > to intall the "antoine_dom0_ debian" distribution and generate DomU
> > instances.  I know you already have a number of DomU builds in tarball
> > form so anyone wanting to try Antoines distribution can get at least
> > some DomU packages from you.
> >
> > Hope you find this experiment worth while but I would very much
> > appreciate your making a kind of dry run on this. This success would be
> > usefull whether we set up a repository/server or the "proposed"
> > repository/server were to become a reality.
> >
> > Antoine:
> > I hope we find you cooperative in this regard.  I think a few dry runs
> > are a good idea in order to ensure success of the kind of
> > repository/server we have been considering.
> >
> > Thanks to the both of you who I have found to be both easy to get along
> > with and very cooperative.  I wish I could participate (you guys have
> > all the fun) but my satellite facilites are still several weeks down the
> > road and all I have right now is 2 slow dial up lines because of my
> > remote location.  I would sure like to test it myself  -- perhaps I can
> > get a DVD blasted for Antoine's Distribution from someone in the big
> > city of Edmonton who has a high speed connection.
> >
> > Anyway I wish you both luck on this, let me know if you are willing to
> > do this so I don't wait for results that are never fothcoming. And have
> > a nice day or evening.  It's late morning where I am.
> >
> > Thanks -- Ted
> >
> >
> >   
>
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