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Re: Clang-format configuration discussion - pt 2


  • To: Julien Grall <julien@xxxxxxx>
  • From: Jan Beulich <jbeulich@xxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2023 09:56:04 +0100
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  • Cc: Luca Fancellu <Luca.Fancellu@xxxxxxx>, Andrew Cooper <andrew.cooper3@xxxxxxxxxx>, Roger Pau Monné <roger.pau@xxxxxxxxxx>, Stefano Stabellini <sstabellini@xxxxxxxxxx>, Bertrand Marquis <Bertrand.Marquis@xxxxxxx>, Michal Orzel <Michal.Orzel@xxxxxxx>, Wei Liu <wl@xxxxxxx>, "xen-devel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx" <xen-devel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>, George Dunlap <george.dunlap@xxxxxxxxx>
  • Delivery-date: Thu, 07 Dec 2023 08:56:15 +0000
  • List-id: Xen developer discussion <xen-devel.lists.xenproject.org>

On 07.12.2023 09:43, Julien Grall wrote:
> On 07/12/2023 07:28, Jan Beulich wrote:
>> On 06.12.2023 18:55, Julien Grall wrote:
>>> On 06/12/2023 02:32, George Dunlap wrote:
>>>> On Tue, Dec 5, 2023 at 2:07 PM Jan Beulich <jbeulich@xxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>> On 05.12.2023 14:46, Luca Fancellu wrote:
>>>>>> In my opinion, I don’t know of any tool that can address all the 
>>>>>> flexibility the Xen codestyle allows, yet the use of automatic
>>>>>> checkers would improve the review time, allow more new contributors to 
>>>>>> approach the community without being put down by
>>>>>> the amount of code-style comments,
>>>>>
>>>>> Since this argument is being repeated: I find it odd. No-one needs to even
>>>>> fear any amount of style comments if they simply follow the written down
>>>>> policy plus a tiny bit of common sense. According to my observation, 
>>>>> (some)
>>>>> newcomers don't even care to look at what is being said about our style.
>>>>> It's not like you and I haven't been through this. When I started working
>>>>> with GNU toolchain, I had to adopt to their style. When I later started to
>>>>> work with Linux, I had to also adopt there. And then for Xen. And all of
>>>>> that already past closed source projects I had been working on before.
>>>
>>> I am not sure I get the point. With this argument, we are not only
>>> putting load on the contributors but also on the reviewers because we
>>> have to check the style manually while reviewing the code.
>>>
>>> Do you really think this is a good use of our time? Personally I don't
>>> think so and definitely there are more unwritten rule than you let
>>> transpire above.
>>>
>>> A good example is the "_" vs "-". If even a maintainer can't guess it,
>>> then how can a contributor know it?
>>
>> I didn't even hint at anything unwritten, did I?
> 
> You didn't and that was my point. I don't think we can put the unwritten 
> rules aside when arguing about how easy it is to follow our coding 
> style. They are usually the ones that tends to be the most contentious 
> and trigger the most debate everytime they come up...

Hmm, I see how you received my comment. It wasn't meant that way, though.
Instead I was trying to convey that even the little that is written down
is largely ignored. Writing down more isn't going to help. But yes, an
automatic checker would likely help in that direction. I'm specifically
not ...

> Obviously if you intend to avoid the coding style checker, then it will 
> be more difficult...

... trying to avoid a checker. What I'm trying to avoid are perhaps yet
more intrusive changes to the entire code base than we're already seeing
with Misra work.

Jan



 


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