Re: [Xen-users] Announcing XenMaster

["Nick Couchman" <Nick.Couchman@xxxxxxxxx>]

Thank you, Jeff.  You are one of a very few voices of reason in this
debate.

Folks, if you don't like Java-based software, or have some view of why
no one should be using Java because of what "big bad Oracle" is doing
with the licensing of it, don't use the software.  It's that simple.
All these folks are doing is letting those of us who are interested know
of a project for managing Xen-based systems.  I also welcome such a
project, regardless of the programming language in which it is written,
especially since there seems to be a distinct lack of good, stable,
complete, and easy-to-use management software out there for XCP (and
XenServer).  Some of us would welcome a Java-based project that would
keep us from having to run a Windows system simply to manage our XCP and
XenServer instances.

You need not attack the writers of the XenMaster code for their choices
- it only serves to discourage them from being part of this community
and from continuing their efforts to make software available to this
community.

-Nick

On Mon, 2012-02-13 at 21:40 +0000, Jeff Sturm wrote:
> I'm reluctant to further a thread that's already off-topic, but two of these 
> sub-topics cause me considerable heartburn...
> 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: xen-users-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:xen-users-
> > bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Linus van Geuns
> > Sent: Sunday, February 12, 2012 7:44 AM
> > 
> > > To conclude: Java works (for us). One can only hope its reputation gets 
> > > better in the
> > years to come.
> > 
> > Actually, besides being somewhat sluggish and fat ..and pretty verbose in 
> > its language
> > part, Java had a pretty good reputation.
> 
> "reputation" is the operative word in your post.  Ii may or may not be 
> supported by facts.  Words like sluggish/fat/verbose are merely opinions 
> without supporting arguments (and I don't want to argue them here).
> 
> The choice of development language is the wrong debate anyway.  There are 
> plenty of examples of high-quality code written in Java, and you'll generally 
> find these are simple to install, easy to run, and perform well.  I've also 
> been forced to use Java code that produces frequent OOM errors, NPE 
> exceptions, deadlocks, etc.  But I doubt it's difficult to find good and bad 
> examples of just about any development language.
> 
> It may be that the average experience level of Java programmers is shorter 
> than for other languages, as someone else suggested.  That may be important 
> to understanding Java's reputation, but it's not important to the XenMaster 
> project.  I personally welcome the opportunity to work with another well 
> engineered, carefully designed OSS project regardless of choice of 
> development language.
> 
> BTW, please don't remind me what Oracle is or isn't doing with Java.  I've 
> heard it before.  Leave that discussion to the tabloids, not a technical user 
> forum.
> 
> > @XenMaster: I would have expected any current Xen management front-
> > end/framework to make use of and help advaince the libvirt project.
> 
> Depends on the project's goals.  My understanding of libvirt is that it is 
> meant to be an abstraction layer to support Xen, KVM and other hypervisors.  
> That's not important if the project's sole focus is Xen/XCP.  Libvirt won't 
> add anything in that case, and it may in fact get in the way.  (My own, brief 
> experiments with libvirt involved installing packages, following the 
> documentation, troubleshooting libvirt and ultimately ignoring it.  Then 
> everything began to work.  It was clear the Xen packages I was using at the 
> time were more mature and/or fully tested than libvirt.  YMMV.)
> 
> -Jeff
> 
> 
> 
> 



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