Re: [Xen-devel] [PATCH v3 3/3] tools: introduce parameter max_wp_ram_ranges.

[Paul Durrant <Paul.Durrant@xxxxxxxxxx>]

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Yu, Zhang [mailto:yu.c.zhang@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]
> Sent: 04 February 2016 08:51
> To: George Dunlap; Ian Jackson
> Cc: Paul Durrant; Kevin Tian; Wei Liu; Ian Campbell; Andrew Cooper; xen-
> devel@xxxxxxxxxxxxx; Stefano Stabellini; zhiyuan.lv@xxxxxxxxx; Jan Beulich;
> Keir (Xen.org)
> Subject: Re: [Xen-devel] [PATCH v3 3/3] tools: introduce parameter
> max_wp_ram_ranges.
> 
> 
> 
> On 2/4/2016 2:21 AM, George Dunlap wrote:
> > On Wed, Feb 3, 2016 at 5:41 PM, George Dunlap
> > <George.Dunlap@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> >> I think at some point I suggested an alternate design based on marking
> >> such gpfns with a special p2m type; I can't remember if that
> >> suggestion was actually addressed or not.
> >
> > FWIW, the thread where I suggested using p2m types was in response to
> >
> > <1436163912-1506-2-git-send-email-yu.c.zhang@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >
> > Looking through it again, the main objection Paul gave[1]  was:
> >
> > "And it's the assertion that use of write_dm will only be relevant to
> > gfns, and that all such notifications only need go to a single ioreq
> > server, that I have a problem with. Whilst the use of io ranges to
> > track gfn updates is, I agree, not ideal I think the overloading of
> > write_dm is not a step in the right direction."
> >
> > Two issues raised here, about using only p2m types to implement
> write_dm:
> > 1. More than one ioreq server may want to use the write_dm functionality
> > 2. ioreq servers may want to use write_dm for things other than individual
> gpfns
> >
> > My answer to #1 was:
> > 1. At the moment, we only need to support a single ioreq server using
> write_dm
> > 2. It's not technically difficult to extend the number of servers
> > supported to something sensible, like 4 (using 4 different write_dm
> > p2m types)
> > 3. The interface can be designed such that we can extend support to
> > multiple servers when we need to.
> >
> > My answer to #2 was that there's no reason why using write_dm could be
> > used for both individual gpfns and ranges; there's no reason the
> > interface can't take a "start" and "count" argument, even if for the
> > time being "count" is almost always going to be 1.
> >
> 
> Well, talking about "the 'count' always going to be 1". I doubt that. :)
> Statistics in XenGT shows that, GPU page tables are very likely to
> be allocated in contiguous gpfns.
> 
> > Compare this to the downsides of the approach you're proposing:
> > 1. Using 40 bytes of hypervisor space per guest GPU pagetable page (as
> > opposed to using a bit in the existing p2m table)
> > 2. Walking down an RB tree with 8000 individual nodes to find out
> > which server to send the message to (rather than just reading the
> > value from the p2m table).
> 
> 8K is an upper limit for the rangeset, in many cases the RB tree will
> not contain that many nodes.
> 
> > 3. Needing to determine on a guest-by-guest basis whether to change the
> limit
> > 4. Needing to have an interface to make the limit even bigger, just in
> > case we find workloads that have even more GTTs.
> >
> 
> Well, I have suggested in yesterday's reply. XenGT can choose not to
> change this limit even when workloads are getting heavy - with
> tradeoffs in the device model side.

I assume this means that the emulator can 'unshadow' GTTs (I guess on an LRU 
basis) so that it can shadow new ones when the limit has been exhausted?
If so, how bad is performance likely to be if we live with a lower limit and 
take the hit of unshadowing if the guest GTTs become heavily fragmented?

  Paul

> 
> > I really don't understand where you're coming from on this.  The
> > approach you've chosen looks to me to be slower, more difficult to
> > implement, and more complicated; and it's caused a lot more resistance
> > trying to get this series accepted.
> >
> 
> I agree utilizing the p2m types to do so is more efficient and quite
> intuitive. But I hesitate to occupy the software available bits in EPT
> PTEs(like Andrew's reply). Although we have introduced one, we believe
> it can also be used for other situations in the future, not just XenGT.
> 
> Thanks
> Yu
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